Rootsi kaitsevõimest (ja Norrast ka)

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Re: Rootsi kaitsevõimest (ja Norrast ka)

Postitus Postitas ruger »

Rootsi tolliametnikud(kõrgendatud valmisoleku/sõja ajal muutuvad osa neist piirivalvuriteks) harjutavad vajadusel automaatidega relvastatuna tööl käimist ja sildade turvamist.
Armed with automatic carbines, customs officials are now practicing at the Oresund Bridge to be ready if war comes.

Some customs officers become border guards on heightened alert. Armed with automatic carbines, they then form part of the first line of defense if Sweden were to be attacked.

But it's not just normal customs tasks that have to be done.
Pilt
https://sverigesradio.se/artikel/har-ov ... ja-angrepp
Ainus, mida me ajaloost õpime, on see, et keegi ei õpi ajaloost midagi.
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Re: Rootsi kaitsevõimest (ja Norrast ka)

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Ka Rootsi riigipiiri rikkusid orkide lennukid(nagu mõned päevad tagasi 4 lennukit Soome riigipiiri). Rikkumiste sageduse kasv näitab, et tegu on tahtlike orkide poolse riigipiiride rikkumistega.
Swedish defense says a Russian Su-24 jet violated Swedish airspace yesterday. The incident happened east of the southern tip of the island of Gotland. The Su-24 was intercepted by a Swedish JAS-39. Russia last violated Swedish airspace in 2022.
Pilt
https://x.com/nukestrat/status/1801934874057593186
Ainus, mida me ajaloost õpime, on see, et keegi ei õpi ajaloost midagi.
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Re: Rootsi kaitsevõimest (ja Norrast ka)

Postitus Postitas Kriku »

Rootsi parlament kiitis teisipäeval heaks seaduseelnõu, mis annab USA relvajõududele loa kasutada 17 baasi ja väljaõppekeskust. Kaitseminister Pål Jonsoni sõnul aitab otsus Rootsi kaitsejõude sõja korral paremini tugevdada. Eelkõige saab Rootsisse tuua USA sõdurite relvi, varustust ja kütust, et vähendada abivägede kohalejõudmise aega. Jonsoni sõnul ei ole tõenäoline, et ameeriklased hakkaksid kõiki 17 rajatist korraga kasutama ning eesmärk on anda liitlastele vajadusel tegevusvabadust.

Poolt hääletas 266 ja vastu 37 saadikut. Vastu olid Vasakpartei ja rohelised, kelles tekitas eelkõige kõhklust, et eelnõu ei välista otsesõnu tuumarelvade Rootsisse toomist. Vasakpartei esindaja Håkan Svenneling märkis, et teiste Põhjala riikide lepetes on selline klausel olemas. Ta lisas, et ehkki eksperdid ei pea USA tuumarelva Rootsi paigutamist tõenäoliseks, võib olukord muutuda, vahendab Expressen.
https://www.delfi.ee/artikkel/120301643 ... sutamiseks
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Re: Rootsi kaitsevõimest (ja Norrast ka)

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Rootsi on muretsenud oma suurematele laevadele droonikaitsesüsteemid.
SE Navy has recently aquired counter UAS for all its larger ships.

Clearly states that any drone that is flying close to a Navy ship might be taken down from now on (this has been an issue, benign or not).

The system vaguely described seem to be electronic only. The system is able to cut the datalink and make a drone crash or return*, but can also identify controller position.

* I suppose this is make/model dependent. No mention of kinetic capability.
https://x.com/auonsson/status/1806958583029870988
Ainus, mida me ajaloost õpime, on see, et keegi ei õpi ajaloost midagi.
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Re: Rootsi kaitsevõimest (ja Norrast ka)

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Norras peeti kinni Hiina luure heaks töötanud tegelane, kes töötas Norra võimul oleva Tööerakonna Oslo meeskonnas koos riigi välisministriga.
On Tuesday, the Police Security Service (PST) arrested a Norwegian man in his 30s for espionage for the benefit of China

The accused also holds office in a local team in the Oslo Labor Party together with key figures in the party, among them Foreign Minister Espen Barth Eide.

According to PST, Chinese intelligence uses a wide range of means to acquire sensitive and classified information. Recruitment of Norwegian citizens who have connections to China in the form of studies is among the methods used. The man had studied in China.

The Labor Party, as this frames, has had an ambiguous role towards China. I hope that what has happened can be a wake-up call for the political circles.

Foreign Minister Espen Barth Eide will not comment on the matter. The Ministry of Foreign Affairs refers to the ongoing investigation.

Party leader and Prime Minister Jonas Gahr Støre (Ap) does not want to comment on the matter, his state secretary Kristoffer Thoner says.
https://x.com/thelostcomms/status/1808437744378527854

Originaalartikkel
On Tuesday, the Police Security Service (PST) agreed to remand a Norwegian man in his 30s for four weeks .

The Oslo District Court believes there is good reason to suspect him following the charge of attempted gross espionage.

Since the arrest on Monday and up until the prison meeting, the accused had not explained himself to PST.

- He says that he is innocent of what he is accused of, and denies that he is an agent for China, says the man's defender Marius Dietrichson to TV 2.

In the imprisonment order, it is indicated that the investigation is in an early and critical phase, and there is a imminent danger that the man will spill evidence if he is released.

According to Thomas Blom, police attorney in PST, this case is the first of its kind in Norway.

- Serious charge

The man who was arrested at Gardermoen on Monday himself states on the internet that he has a doctorate from one of China's elite universities. He was on his way home from China when the arrest took place.

- It is a serious charge, which indicates that Chinese intelligence is active in Norway. The big question is to what extent he has had access to information that could weaken Norway's interests or security, says Tom Røseth, head teacher in intelligence at the Defense Staff School, to TV 2.

The intelligence expert says that PST has previously warned that there is significant Chinese intelligence activity against Norway, both physically and digitally.

The researcher charged with espionage has in recent years published specialist articles dealing with China's international role and the games of the great powers.
- Challenging

Now PST has received the court's approval to review the man's data-carrying devices and other electronic traces in cloud services while he is in custody.

- With today's technological solutions, it is much more challenging to find concrete evidence, but it is not impossible. Digital evidence can be demanding to go through, considering encryption, says Røseth.

According to PST, Chinese intelligence uses a wide range of means to acquire sensitive and classified information. Recruitment of Norwegian citizens who have connections to China in the form of studies is among the methods used.

The accused also holds office in a local team in the Oslo Labor Party together with key figures in the party, among them Foreign Minister Espen Barth Eide (Ap).

Røseth says on a general basis that political environments are important targets for foreign intelligence.

- If you take part in forums where security policy is discussed in confidence with politicians in the Storting and members of the foreign affairs and defense committee, you can gain access to information before the policy is formulated. Then this is to be considered sensitive information, says Røseth to TV 2.
Taust i Ap

China expert and author Torbjørn Færøvik says he knew about the accused man from before, but that he has not met him.

The Chinese university the accused studied at describes Færøvik as "one of the great universities" in China.

- Norway has an important position in Europe. Strategically, militarily and in every way. This awakening here at home has taken far too long, says Færøvik to TV 2.

He points out that PST's warnings about Chinese intelligence activities have become increasingly strong.

- The aim of the espionage in this case may have been to get a foothold in the political circles, probe moods and map people and attitudes. Such things, says Færøvik.

The China expert does not know what kind of evidence the PST is relying on in the investigation of the Norwegian accused of spying, but believes there is not enough vigilance in the political parties.

- The Labor Party, as this frames, has had an ambiguous role towards China. I hope what has happened can be a wake-up call for the political circles in particular, says the China expert.

Foreign Minister Espen Barth Eide will not comment on the matter. The Ministry of Foreign Affairs refers to the ongoing investigation.

Party leader and Prime Minister Jonas Gahr Støre (Ap) does not want to comment on the matter, his state secretary Kristoffer Thoner says.

Oslo Ap says the following about the accused:

- He has participated in this party team for some time, but has not held any prominent positions of trust anywhere in Oslo Ap, says Frode Jacobsen, who is a leader in Oslo Ap, to TV 2.
High priority targets

Norwegian research and educational institutions are high priority targets for Chinese intelligence. At the same time, China has become Norway's biggest partner in technological research, according to Khrono .

Despite warnings in PST's threat assessment in 2022, the cooperation continued. Through the Panorama strategy, the government works to ensure that the Norwegian research community increases cooperation with countries such as China.

In the threat assessment for 2023, PST said that Chinese intelligence uses a wide range of means to acquire advanced technology, knowledge and sensitive information from Norwegian businesses and institutions.

In the threat assessment for 2024, PST writes that the worsening relationship between China and the West will lead to an increased intelligence threat from China.

PST warns in this year's threat assessment that Chinese intelligence services are recruiting Norwegian citizens to gain access to sensitive and classified information.

- These are often people who have connections to China in the form of studies, work, friends or family, writes PST.
China responds

The Chinese embassy in Oslo writes in an email to TV 2 that they have learned that a Norwegian is suspected of espionage for the benefit of China.

They do not answer the case specifically, but speak on a more general basis.

- Recently, there have been cases where certain European countries have fabricated so-called "Chinese spy cases" and deliberately slandered China. We strongly oppose such actions. Certain Norwegian actors have repeatedly made irresponsible accusations without providing concrete facts and propagated the "China threat", which greatly disturbed the normal atmosphere of cooperation between China and Norway.

The embassy further writes that China has always followed the principles of mutual respect.

- We hope the relevant actors will abandon their biased views and adopt an objective and fair attitude towards China. We believe that the Norwegian side will base its position on the facts, be on guard against attempts to damage bilateral relations and take concrete steps to maintain a healthy and stable development of the relationship between our two countries.
https://www.tv2.no/nyheter/innenriks/ek ... /16815120/
Ainus, mida me ajaloost õpime, on see, et keegi ei õpi ajaloost midagi.
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Re: Rootsi kaitsevõimest (ja Norrast ka)

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Eide on minu arvates kõige rumalam välisminister,keda ma siin Norras olen näinud.Juba välimus on selline,et teisest tuleks eemale hoida.
Väidetavalt just tema oli see isik,kes surus valitsusele peale Palestiina riigi tunnustamise.Täielik tobedus ruudus.
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Re: Rootsi kaitsevõimest (ja Norrast ka)

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Norras Hiina jaoks toimetanud spioonist veel
The man who, according to PST, is an agent for China, has a doctorate from one of China's elite universities. He has been associated with the Labor Party for several years.
https://www.tv2.no/nyheter/innenriks/sp ... /16813704/
Ainus, mida me ajaloost õpime, on see, et keegi ei õpi ajaloost midagi.
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Re: Rootsi kaitsevõimest (ja Norrast ka)

Postitus Postitas Gideonic »

Ameeriklased keeldusid ATACMS järglase PrSM müügist Norrale. Isegi 150km lennuulatusega GMLRS ER versiooni müügist keelduti, saavad osta vaid standartseid GLMRS rakette 90km lennuulatusega!

https://x.com/thelostcomms/status/1827942934655664485
🇧🇻 Norway is not allowed to buy the Americans' new long-range missile
The procurement of long-range precision fire for the Army is in a decisive phase.

Norway will not be able to purchase the newly developed Precision Strike Missile (PrSM), which should be able to hit targets up to 499 kilometers away.

The US has also rejected Norway's request to be given the opportunity to buy the GMLRS Extended Range missile with a range of 150 kilometers. The Norwegian Defense Forces may only purchase versions of the missile with a shorter range (up to 90 K)

Not good
Väga haige käitumine USA poolt. Ilmselt ei müüda siis ka meile neid ATACMSeid ega järeltulijaid mida me siin moonahangetega osta soovime.

Variant on Euroopa kaitsekoostöö aga sellega läheb ajuvabalt kaua aega. Ainus reaalne alternatiiv oleks ilmselt Lõuna KOrea K239 Chunmoo. Aga ka sellele saaks USA ilmselt pidurit tõmmata, kui tahaks
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Re: Rootsi kaitsevõimest (ja Norrast ka)

Postitus Postitas nukkel »

Huvitav miks ei müüda?
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Re: Rootsi kaitsevõimest (ja Norrast ka)

Postitus Postitas LupusII »

Tekitavad meie ostuks laovaru ... :-) Palju meil neid laskeseadmeid tuleb ? 6tk? ATACAMS saab korraga lasta 2 tk. Kurat milline äge logistika meil olema saab ja milline lähikaitse sellele logistikale ? Võimas !
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Re: Rootsi kaitsevõimest (ja Norrast ka)

Postitus Postitas Veiko Palm »

Gideonic kirjutas: 26 Aug, 2024 9:25 Ameeriklased keeldusid ATACMS järglase PrSM müügist Norrale. Isegi 150km lennuulatusega GMLRS ER versiooni müügist keelduti, saavad osta vaid standartseid GLMRS rakette 90km lennuulatusega!

https://x.com/thelostcomms/status/1827942934655664485
🇧🇻 Norway is not allowed to buy the Americans' new long-range missile
The procurement of long-range precision fire for the Army is in a decisive phase.

Norway will not be able to purchase the newly developed Precision Strike Missile (PrSM), which should be able to hit targets up to 499 kilometers away.

The US has also rejected Norway's request to be given the opportunity to buy the GMLRS Extended Range missile with a range of 150 kilometers. The Norwegian Defense Forces may only purchase versions of the missile with a shorter range (up to 90 K)

Not good
Väga haige käitumine USA poolt. Ilmselt ei müüda siis ka meile neid ATACMSeid ega järeltulijaid mida me siin moonahangetega osta soovime.

Variant on Euroopa kaitsekoostöö aga sellega läheb ajuvabalt kaua aega. Ainus reaalne alternatiiv oleks ilmselt Lõuna KOrea K239 Chunmoo. Aga ka sellele saaks USA ilmselt pidurit tõmmata, kui tahaks
Huvitav, millele see ülalolev jutt tugineb (peale selle X postituse)? Kõik muud allikad räägivad ikka sellest, et Norra saab osta Himarse koos atacmsidega. Osad allikad annavad isegi nende arvu - 160. Ja selle Prismiga on natuke erijuhtum.
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Re: Rootsi kaitsevõimest (ja Norrast ka)

Postitus Postitas lennumudelist »

Ennast kah huvitas ja lappasin veidi. Wikipedia artikkel annab viites 17 säärase allika:

https://www.forsvaretsforum.no/forsvars ... sil/392078

Kuna norra keel on paras pähkel, kasutasin automaattõlget ja silusin käsitsi:
Norrat ootab miljardi dollarine investeering pikamaa täppistule relvadesse. Augustis kiideti USA poolt heaks taotlus hankida M142 HIMARS suurtükiväe raketisüsteeme.

Kokkulepe väärtusega 6.2 miljardit krooni hõlmab 16 HIMARS süsteemi ja 130 kolme eri tüüpi raketti.

USA paraku ei kiitnud heaks Norra taotlust ligipääsuks uusimatele rakettidele nagu PrSM ja GMLRS-ER.

PrSM tegevusraadius on 499 km, GMLRS-ER oma aga 150 km. USA võimaldab Norral soetada üksnes GMLRS-i vanemat varianti tegevusraadiusega 90 km.

Eelnevast annab teada Teknisk Ukeblad [tõlkija märkus: maksumüüri taga olev alg-allikas siin: https://www.tu.no/artikler/norge-far-ik ... =row1_pos1 ].

Forsvarsmateriell-i (ei tea õiget tõlget) Bo Espen kommenteeris: "me jätkame tööd nende rakettide saamiseks, kuid see võib toimuda mõnevõrra hiljem tulevikus".

Praegu otsustatakse, kas Norra kinnitab lepingu ameeriklastega või avab konkursi ülejäänud turule.
PrSM on ka niivõrd uus asi, et kujutleks - seal võib olla tingivas kõneviisis ütlemisi, näiteks "hetkel ei saa".

ATACMS-i osas: kuuldavasti oli Soome millalgi poole aasta toodangu ära ostnud, seega mingeid suhtumise probleeme, millele ülal viidati, mina ei kahtlustaks - pigem saadavuse probleeme. Väga ei üllataks, kui tellimusi oleks rohkem, kui tootmisvõimet.
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Re: Rootsi kaitsevõimest (ja Norrast ka)

Postitus Postitas nukkel »

Tänud tõlkimast ja valgustamast.
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Re: Rootsi kaitsevõimest (ja Norrast ka)

Postitus Postitas Veiko Palm »

Tänan tõlkimast. Kindlasti ei ole siin tegemist suhtumise või usaldamatusega. DSCA kodulehel selge info https://www.dsca.mil/press-media/major- ... et-systems - kui ATACMS müüakse, siis miks teisi ei peaks müüma?
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Re: Rootsi kaitsevõimest (ja Norrast ka)

Postitus Postitas kaugeltuuriv »

Ma lihtsalt spekuleerin kuulduste põhjal,mis siin Norras liiguvad.Asi on osaliselt ikka seotud poliitikaga,nimelt Norra valitsuse otsusega tunnistada Palestiina iseseisvust.Ma ennist siin mainisin,et lollimat välisministrit nagu Eide annab minu arust otsida Norra välispoliitika ajaloost.Ma ei tea,millistest juppidest need pikema ulatusega moon on koostatud aga võimalik,et mingisugused jublakad elektrooniliselt tulevad ka Israeli kaitsetööstusest.Näitena toon ma Nammo osaluse USA tarkmoona ja Javelinide tootmisel,selgelt on kõrgtehnoloogia baasil tehtaval moonal lai rahvusvaheline osalus ning võimalik,et Israeli kaitsetööstus on allhangetega raketimoona tootmisel tegev nagu ka Norra Nammo.Ja juudid oskavad nööre tõmmata ning nad on tigedad.Näiteks tühistati kõikide Norra diplomaatide akrediteering,kes suhtlesid Gaza sektori ja Läänekaldaga.Nad saadeti kõik koju ja norrakatele keelati edaspidi sinna aladele sisenemine,millest toosama Eide hapu näoga televisioonis teatas.
See nädal toimub valitsuse eelarvekonverents,kus arutatakse uut eelarvet.Esimest korda pika aja jooksul on kaitsevaldkond tõstetud esimesele reale,huvitav,kas see raketiost ka leiab uues valguses kajastamist.
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